I'm all for going out to where people are to tell them about the gospel of Christ. As one who was on the wrong side of a shot glass in my rebellious years, I'm glad Christians hoping to share the gospel with me didn't give me a shot glass...
...and a weak ecclesiology. There's a sense of propriety when we come together corporately to worship the Creator of the universe. It doesn't mean we can't be a little expressive in our worship, but self-indulgence is counterproductive during a time when God should be our focus.
Oh boy. This goes even further than "tickling ears". We're supposed to go to the world and season it with something different. Salt doesn't taste a thing like anything else. If it tastes like sugar, it probably is sugar. And the world we are supposed to be reaching knows that sometimes better than we do.
I too know that we must plant churches anywhere and everywhere, that isn't the problem--far from it. But a bar isn't church--it's a bar. I don't care what some say. The end doesn't, can't and won't justify the means.
Do I have a problem with alcohol across the board? No. That is not a scriptural holding and doesn't exemplify Christian liberty. But I also remember something about stumbling blocks and making no appearance of evil.
Having a glass of wine, or a good beer now and then is one thing. Using alcohol to get butts in the seats (or bar stools) is completely another.
I admire the motivation to not be, or appear to be, "stuffy" a.k.a.--legalistic. But it would not be legalistic to stand outside the bars and taverns and tell people--lovingly--that we need to be somewhere else--spiritually and physically.
I worry that things like this put WAY too much emphasis on the love and little or no emphasis on the One Thing that gives love meaning and justified existence: God's Holiness.
I guess, Scripturally, our attitude should be more that of the account of Phillip and Nathanael in John 1:46. We should be saying "come and see" and yes, we should go to these folks, but bring them out and bring them back to where we all need to be--separated, holy.
...a bar isn't church--it's a bar. Well, isn't church a body of people with a collective goal? Whose inside the bars, People...right? I must say that I applaud these efforts to take the gospel to these people where ever they are... as Jesus did. If you look at this from a psychological stand-point, the shot glasses make sense, due to the fact that alcohol, during the early stages of consumption, allows you the sort of let your guard down, thus leading to open mindedness. We must note that not all people go to the bar to get drunk too. A lot of people go to unwind and communicate with others. In all, if this leads anyone closer to a faith, then the efforts are well worth it. Also, coffee and donuts during church. I think this is quite okay, considering that the caffeine and sugar rush are guaranteed to keep you woke and more attentive. It will also drive the children up the wall. But, it would be your choice to consume.
The thing is this. There is much difference between people in the body of Christ and people in the body of booze. It really as off as saying a "A dog has hair and teeth. I have hair and teeth. Therefore, I can act like a dog because we're really no different."
Maybe if I was a little less than sober this would sound logical...
I have no problem with going to bars and preaching the gospel in word AND deed. But I don't see the separation from the world Christians are called to here. I hope I am wrong, but knowing what I know of all the movements these days to make the Church less different than the world, this seems like more of the same liquored down gospel.
Are bringing the Bread of Life to the entire world, or bread and circuses to appeasement hungry masses?
1. Three heads are better than one. The bloggers will be Missy, Tyris and Lionel
2. This will be a Reformed Blog with a heavy emphasis on urban issues
3. We want to proclaim God's providence, while at the same time being culturally relevant. We love the dead guys, but God has continued to use both history and modern day believers to shape His people (a lot of blogs regurgetate while ignoring todays issues).
4. Our goal is to also challenge each other, our presuppositions, and to work through theology electronically (since we live in the south, midwest, and east coast) in hopes to become more like our Lord.
I pray that you will join us and point others to this blog. God bless.
8 comments:
I'm all for going out to where people are to tell them about the gospel of Christ. As one who was on the wrong side of a shot glass in my rebellious years, I'm glad Christians hoping to share the gospel with me didn't give me a shot glass...
...and a weak ecclesiology. There's a sense of propriety when we come together corporately to worship the Creator of the universe. It doesn't mean we can't be a little expressive in our worship, but self-indulgence is counterproductive during a time when God should be our focus.
By the way - Happy MLK day: The dream is still alive!
Oh boy.
This goes even further than "tickling ears". We're supposed to go to the world and season it with something different. Salt doesn't taste a thing like anything else. If it tastes like sugar, it probably is sugar. And the world we are supposed to be reaching knows that sometimes better than we do.
I too know that we must plant churches anywhere and everywhere, that isn't the problem--far from it. But a bar isn't church--it's a bar. I don't care what some say. The end doesn't, can't and won't justify the means.
Do I have a problem with alcohol across the board? No. That is not a scriptural holding and doesn't exemplify Christian liberty. But I also remember something about stumbling blocks and making no appearance of evil.
Having a glass of wine, or a good beer now and then is one thing. Using alcohol to get butts in the seats (or bar stools) is completely another.
I admire the motivation to not be, or appear to be, "stuffy" a.k.a.--legalistic. But it would not be legalistic to stand outside the bars and taverns and tell people--lovingly--that we need to be somewhere else--spiritually and physically.
I worry that things like this put WAY too much emphasis on the love and little or no emphasis on the One Thing that gives love meaning and justified existence: God's Holiness.
I find this very common and concerning.
That's my take Bro
I guess, Scripturally, our attitude should be more that of the account of Phillip and Nathanael in John 1:46. We should be saying "come and see" and yes, we should go to these folks, but bring them out and bring them back to where we all need to be--separated, holy.
I don't think that was being stated here.
See what I mean?
...a bar isn't church--it's a bar.
Well, isn't church a body of people with a collective goal? Whose inside the bars, People...right? I must say that I applaud these efforts to take the gospel to these people where ever they are... as Jesus did. If you look at this from a psychological stand-point, the shot glasses make sense, due to the fact that alcohol, during the early stages of consumption, allows you the sort of let your guard down, thus leading to open mindedness. We must note that not all people go to the bar to get drunk too. A lot of people go to unwind and communicate with others. In all, if this leads anyone closer to a faith, then the efforts are well worth it.
Also, coffee and donuts during church. I think this is quite okay, considering that the caffeine and sugar rush are guaranteed to keep you woke and more attentive. It will also drive the children up the wall. But, it would be your choice to consume.
The thing is this. There is much difference between people in the body of Christ and people in the body of booze. It really as off as saying a "A dog has hair and teeth. I have hair and teeth. Therefore, I can act like a dog because we're really no different."
Maybe if I was a little less than sober this would sound logical...
I have no problem with going to bars and preaching the gospel in word AND deed. But I don't see the separation from the world Christians are called to here. I hope I am wrong, but knowing what I know of all the movements these days to make the Church less different than the world, this seems like more of the same liquored down gospel.
Are bringing the Bread of Life to the entire world, or bread and circuses to appeasement hungry masses?
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